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US Economy Crushed by Excess Debt

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icebreaker1975
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Silver
Crushed...
icebreaker1975   6/8/2011 10:10:41 AM
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is an understatement.  If this is any indication of what we can expect in the future, we might as well throw in the towel.  I want to believe that its going to get better, I really do...but until we can see a turnaround, it looks as though we are going to have to deal with this debt for long, long time.

Scott Raynovich
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Blogger
Re: Crushed by Debt
Scott Raynovich   6/1/2011 9:39:06 AM
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impactnow:

"however the poll did not follow up with the most important question. Are Americans willing to pay the price required to maintain the debt ceiling? Can they truly bear the consequences of a fixed budget ?"

That's right. The answer is probably no. Everybody wants everything: Low taxes, high levels of service, a nice retirement, free healthcare, a balanced budget, e.t.c. Nobody wants to pay the price for anything

impactnow
User Rank
Iron
Crushed by Debt
impactnow   5/31/2011 11:27:31 PM
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A poll published today indicated the majority of Americans do not want to raise the debt ceiling—however the poll did not follow up with the most important question. Are Americans willing to pay the price required to maintain the debt ceiling? Can they truly bear the consequences of a fixed budget ?

Scott McCaig
User Rank
Gold
Re: Spending is like crack for polititians
Scott McCaig   5/31/2011 11:05:27 PM
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Scott,

Pretty dismal, but I agree. I think 2008 was very scary, but I think conbined with the dumbing-down of Americans is the shortening attention span. If it didn't happen in the last 72 hours, it didn't happen!

Scott Raynovich
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Blogger
Re: Spending is like crack for polititians
Scott Raynovich   5/31/2011 10:23:58 PM
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Scott,

Maybe the system can't rebuild itself until it implodes? What is truly scary is that the last financial crisis wasn't enough to scare people into action. According to many measures, the banking system is actually MORE leveraged than it was in 2008 due to the growth in financial derivatives.

Yes, it's a huge problem. I have no idea how to solve it. The rational solution would be to deleverage, but that would take 10 years minimum, get all the politicians voted out of office, and piss off a lot of people. So the government prints money and allows banks to leverage right back up. It's like your last house burned down because you stored fireworks in the garage so now you're building a bigger house with a bigger garage and even more fireworks.

Here are some interesting comments from Mark Mobius on the issue:

"Are the banks bigger than they were before? They're bigger," Mobius said.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international-business/another-financial-crisis-brewing-mark-mobius/articleshow/8654314.cms


 

Scott Raynovich
User Rank
Blogger
Re: some never learn
Scott Raynovich   5/31/2011 10:18:31 PM
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It's the vote everybody expected. In the meantime, they will try to hammer out a budget agreement, and the government goes on, borrowing billions of dollars a day from our pension funds.

icebreaker1975
User Rank
Silver
Re: some never learn
icebreaker1975   5/31/2011 9:13:34 PM
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This just in...House votes not to increase debt ceiling...Good or Bad Decision?

Scott McCaig
User Rank
Gold
Re: Spending is like crack for polititians
Scott McCaig   5/31/2011 7:04:27 PM
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Scott,

I agree completely, but what about the fact (explained very well in the little video series I referenced) that the current system depends on ever-increasing debt. I'm not very omptimistic that the current "broken" system will be changed given the power in the purse strings for campaign financing, the fact that the public's level of understanding is very simplistic (e.g. taxes are bad, debt is bad, I want the "stuff" that I want, the country should have a goal of having zero debt, (as if businesses don't depend on debt to grow), etc.), and finally the lack of any proposals to tear down the monster that's been created and start from scratch?

Scott Raynovich
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Spending is like crack for polititians
Scott Raynovich   5/31/2011 6:47:30 PM
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Scott,

That's the exact problem. The leveraged banking system is broken. The government is trying to leverage it even more. They don't want you know that.

Money isn't about debt if you don't have much debt. Then it's about money.

--Scott

Scott McCaig
User Rank
Gold
Re: Spending is like crack for polititians
Scott McCaig   5/31/2011 12:23:30 PM
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What about the underlying mechanics of how (most) money really is nothing more than debt. When we talk about spending more or less and taxing more or less, isn't it all layered upon a system that can only work when debt grows infinitely (and bad things happen when it doesn't)?

I think it's helpful for the general public to realize that the modern banking systems are indeed based on money simply being debt.

I wonder what the general public's reaction would be if people really understood this dynamic and what events over history gave birth to it.

Watch...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVkFb26u9g8

(make sure you get past the first couple of minutes to the actual content). This is a short animated video with four more in the series if you want more.

If the link doesn't work, just search youtube for "money as debt" and pick the 10-minute video that says "Part 1 of 5".

I'd be eager to hear the reactions from all the well-informed contributors here!

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